Overview
In the second episode of the Fan Method podcast hosted by Dr. Larry Fan, master esthetician and perioperative aesthetic specialist Eva Claiborne discusses her extensive background in skincare and her holistic approach to beauty and wellness. Eva, who owns Eva Claiborne Beauty and Wellness in Tiburon, California, shares insights from her five-year intensive master's program in Hungary, emphasizing the integration of both modern and traditional techniques, including the historical Hungarian facial massage. She offers valuable advice on anti-aging treatments, recommending the seasonal use of retinol, and advocates for natural, organic skincare products over pricier options. Eva also highlights her own product line, TiTok naturals, which focuses on sensitive skin, and encourages early skincare routines to promote self-esteem. The episode concludes with action items for both Dr. Fan and Eva to explore her product line further for personal and professional application.
Notes
Introduction and Background(00:01 - 05:06)
- Dr. Larry Fan hosts the Fan Method podcast
- Guest: Eva Claiborne, master esthetician and perioperative aesthetic specialist
- Eva owns Eva Claiborne Beauty and Wellness in Tiberon, California
- Eva earned her master's degree in Skincare in Hungary in 1983
- Hungarian master esthetician program is a five-year intensive course
- Eva focuses on anti-aging, sensitivity, rosacea, and acne treatments
Skincare Approach and Techniques(05:06 - 09:29)
- Eva combines new and traditional techniques in her practice
- Uses Hydrafacial, facial massage, and LED therapy
- Hungarian facial massage technique dates back to the 17th century
- Eva emphasizes the importance of skincare for both women and men
- Believes in the connection between beauty and wellness
Anti-Aging Treatments and Product Use(09:29 - 19:58)
- Retinol recommended for use from October to March, once or twice a week
- Advises against overusing retinol, especially during summer
- Suggests changing skincare regimen seasonally
- Warns against focusing solely on price when choosing skincare products
- Recommends natural, organic products over expensive department store brands
- Excited about combining Hydrafacial with microneedling and hydration treatments
Skincare Products and Professional Advice(19:58 - 30:18)
- Eva developed her own product line: TiTok naturals
- Products focus on natural ingredients and are suitable for sensitive skin
- Emphasizes the importance of professional treatments alongside home care
- Recommends starting skincare routines early (around age 14)
- Stresses the connection between feeling good about oneself and skincare
Transcript
00:01
Dr. Fan
Welcome to the Fan Method, the plastic surgery, aesthetics and health podcast where we talk about everything you need to know to look and feel your best inside and out. I'm your host, Dr. Larry Fan, and we're so excited to have a great episode for you today. Our topic is something that affects all of us, Anti aging skin care. I'm so excited to welcome our guest master esthetician, Eva Claiborne. Eva, welcome to the show.
00:29
Eva Claiborne
Thank you very much. I'm Eva Claiborne, a master esthetician and a perioperative aesthetic specialist. And I own and operate Eva Claiborne Beauty and Wellness in Tiberon, California.
00:44
Dr. Fan
Wonderful to meet you. Starting off, I'd love to learn a little bit more about you and your background.
00:49
Eva Claiborne
I was growing up in Hungary, Budapest, and earned my master degree in Skincare in 1983.
00:59
Dr. Fan
Wow. And you know, I understand that you're not just an esthetician, but you're a master esthetician and that you have a lot of sort of years of education as well as experience. Can you tell me a little bit more about that?
01:11
Eva Claiborne
Yes. The master esthetician program in Hungary, it's a five years program. The first two years, we study basic skincare and learn to create our skincare line. And after we graduate, we study with the master for two years and working with the master. And the fifth year, I was trained with the top dermatologist in the skincare clinic. And I was aware of, I learned all of the skincare sicknesses, all of the type of cancers and electrocosmetics. So after the five years, when we get ready for the examination, it's a two days examination. The first day when we have the return test and the verbal test. At the second day, we meet our client who we never seen before. We analyze her skin and then create our skincare line for that particular skin type. And then afternoon, we do the technical examination.
02:19
Dr. Fan
Great. And for those, you know, for those people in our audience who, you know, aren't intimately familiar with what an esthetician is and what an esthetician does. Can you talk, you know, can you tell us a little bit more about, you know, what is it that you focus on?
02:34
Eva Claiborne
Yeah, I focus on anti aging because we all age and we would like to keep our youth as long as we can. However, we have sensitivity skin and we have also rosacea, which is very common these days, and also acne.
02:55
Dr. Fan
Sure. So it sounds like you help people take care of their skin so they can look youthful and look beautiful, but you also help people with Various skin conditions like acne rotation, I'm sure a whole host of other things.
03:08
Eva Claiborne
Absolutely.
03:09
Dr. Fan
Well, great. And you know, understand that, you know, your background coming from Hungary, that Hungary is known for its skincare. And can you tell me a little bit about sort of, you know, what makes your sort of approach to taking care of skin different than maybe, you know, someone from the United States?
03:27
Eva Claiborne
Yes. Skincare and body therapy goes back for a very long time in Europe because it's come from the romance. They took care of their body and they did massages. Then the Turkish people developed the hamams more focused on body treatments. And in the 17th century when Dr. Jacquult discovered the anti aging facial massage technique he taught for the French estheticians and Hungary was a second nation who took it over and they still today teaching the same method, the anti aging facial massage method.
04:06
Dr. Fan
Oh wow. So 17th century.
04:08
Eva Claiborne
17Th century.
04:09
Dr. Fan
Long time.
04:10
Eva Claiborne
A long time. Yes. And in United States the skincare began only the 1970s. So it's just a little bit newer here. But people really excited about and they try it out and many people have regular treatments.
04:29
Dr. Fan
Wow. And can you tell us a little bit more about sort of the facial massage method as well as, you know, other I guess, practices or approaches that you use sort of commonly?
04:41
Eva Claiborne
Yes, actually I have a patent on changing skin appearance. And it starts with the soothing movements and then an energizing treatment and I finish up with the lymphatic drainage. And so the skin not only become firmer but also beautiful, relaxed and clean. And when we do the massage, the Hungarian facial massage, we speed up the circulation and the circulation is hard to regenerate the muscle so the skin will be more tight.
05:19
Dr. Fan
Wow. And so if I heard correctly, so energy, harmony and then the lymphatic massage.
05:27
Eva Claiborne
Yes.
05:27
Dr. Fan
And you know, for those readers who are curious to know more or they really want to know, what does it sort of feel like and how long does it take to do the treatments, etc. Can you sort of, you know, walk me through sort of what it's like if, you know, if you're going to do a facial massage for someone like myself?
05:46
Eva Claiborne
Yes. So the minimum time what I am spending on it's 20 minutes and for a longer treatment, 30 minutes. So that's the massage part normally the facial, 60 or 80 minutes with the cleansing. I like to use hydrafacial. The last 10 years I am very successful with that. And then after the Hydrafacial we do the massage, the facial massage and then the mask and the LED therapy. And the LED therapy is changing between. Depends what type of skin we are working. Either the red, the blue or the green.
06:24
Dr. Fan
Yeah. Oh, wow. So it sounds like you're actually both new school and old school. You know, I'm going to guess in the 17th century led therapy wasn't part of it, part of the practice then. And can you tell me about how, you know, sort of your techniques have evolved over time and you know what you're most excited about, what you do now?
06:42
Eva Claiborne
Yes. I studied in Europe and in United States constantly. I still taking classes and studied with different masters and teachers. And also I was an international trainer for a big Spanish company and Dr. Babor company in Germany. And through the years I got different little techniques from different teachers and. Yes. And I just combined them together.
07:20
Dr. Fan
Yeah. Wow, that's great. And you know, like you, I'm a lifelong student and you know, part of the fun of being in healthcare and the beauty and health is that the learning never stops. And there is always, you know, there are always new developments. There are always, you know, new ways we can all sort of improve ourselves. And that's part of what makes it so fun, isn't it?
07:41
Eva Claiborne
Yes, it is fun and exciting and it's. I love to learn. Yeah. I love to be with other people and exchange tips and tricks.
07:52
Dr. Fan
Well, that's great. And you know, I'm curious to know, you know, how do you. Do you approach sort of skincare for women as opposed to men? Do you approach each gender differently?
08:05
Eva Claiborne
A little bit. A little bit. Men hesitant to have skincare. They only come if the wife tells them to come or they buy the product for them or if they have a problem, if they have a rosacea or they have acne. And then once they see the result and they are happy, then they are the most loyal clients. And Lilo bat, of course, they have different skin type, they have a beard. So we want to be more gentle. We have certain movement, but we are used or we don't use. Like the woman is easier to be massaged more, has a speeding technique like the gentleman, they have more lymphatic drainage or more soothing calming treatments.
08:56
Dr. Fan
It's really true. I couldn't agree with you more that, you know, majority of people who really prioritize their parents are women. But today we are seeing more and more men, especially in area like the San Francisco Bay area where we're both located. You know, people not only want to sort of live good, they want to live good lives. And part of that is looking good. Yes. And, you know, that brings me to another sort of topic. I know that you have some, you know, I guess specific beliefs in the relationship of beauty to wellness. Can you talk about that?
09:30
Eva Claiborne
Yes. In Hungary, skincare is everyday life. It's not a luxury. So we are going to the skincare and Hungary. It's very specially located. It's sitting on the top of the volcano and we have over 1000 hot mineral hot springs. It's a medicinal water which is the temperature is over 30 Celsius. So me as a little girl, with my mother, my grandmother, we regularly visited these baths once a week and sitting, enjoying the bathing ritual and we felt good. And today, when I grown up, and until today, doctor prescribe for patients to go to the spa sitting in the water, depends what condition they have. And then have treatments after, have massages or different physical therapies after the bath.
10:35
Dr. Fan
Yeah. Wow.
10:36
Eva Claiborne
And so beauty is for me, it's the inner love, the inner peace, and it's very important. You are beautiful if you feel beautiful, if you are healthy.
10:51
Dr. Fan
Yeah.
10:51
Eva Claiborne
And that's why I cannot separate beauty and wellness.
10:56
Dr. Fan
Yeah, yeah. I, you know, I couldn't agree more with that. You know, there are a lot of, I guess listeners who are maybe, you know, interested in taking care, you know, of their skin, many of whom know, you know a little bit about skin, some who know quite a bit. But there's so much information out there's so many different messages and it's easy to get overwhelmed or get confused. You know, if you had the opportunity to sit in front of, you know, every single, you know, woman, you know, person, you know, man or woman who's out there listening and wondering, what do I need to know about my skin? What would you tell them?
11:34
Eva Claiborne
Keep it simple. The skincare is very important. The home in the professional skincare, also the home care regimen. But the home care regimen should be appropriate for the skin, their skin. Because we have over 3,000 skincare companies and a lot of time people buying and buying products and it's not good for them. So they have. The number one problem is the incorrect cosmetics that cause the most damage for the skin. And the most important thing in my mind, keep it simple, have a good cleanser, a serum which has all of the good active ingredients and the moisturizer or a cream which is sealing it into the skin. So I'm not only working on the top of the skin, I like to work in the skin. That's why I use Hydrafacial to keep the Skin open.
12:32
Eva Claiborne
I love microneedling, but I also like to have a simple home care regimen.
12:39
Dr. Fan
Well, that's great. And for those people who are listening and asking themselves, well, gosh, how do I know whether I'm using the right cosmetics? Is there, you know, some advice you can give for them, some guidance on how they can, you know, sort of, you know that, or do they need to come in, come and see you?
12:56
Eva Claiborne
Yes, I like to see the client who really care about their skin if I am using a right product or not. I like to ask them to bring the product and I, we go over and I tell them, this is good, this is not good. Why is this good? And why is not good? So I explain, I teach them. So we have a nice consultation and then we can adjust the product accordingly. What the skin type needs.
13:25
Dr. Fan
That's great. Makes a lot of sense. And so it sounds like, you know, people using the wrong products is one of the most common sort of mistakes that you see or opportunities for people to be able to improve themselves. What are some of the other most common, you know, mistakes that you see people make when they're taking care of their skin?
13:44
Eva Claiborne
Not everyone believes in skincare and dating. A laser and chemical peel is the best thing. It is good. However, we don't want to overdo it. If someone have a laser treatment or chemical peel, give the skin a rest and have rehabilitate the skin between the lasers. And I think it's very important to have also soothing, calming, hydrating, conscious skincare product at home so the skin will be able to recover.
14:23
Dr. Fan
Yeah, yeah, it makes a lot of sense. And you know, I couldn't agree that a lot of people, you know, as a plastic surgeon, I see a lot of people who are often in a place where they know they need help. Either that or they're highly motivated. They just really like to take care of themselves. But I also wish that, you know, everybody, you know, would take the time to put themselves first and to spend that little bit of time taking care of their body, their health, but also their skin. And I know in today's world, we're all so busy, we've got so many things to do and it can be overwhelming. Just think, you know, what do I really do? And I couldn't agree with you more though.
15:04
Dr. Fan
But keeping it simple as a great way to be able to get a little bit of help.
15:07
Eva Claiborne
Yes.
15:08
Dr. Fan
So let's take a minute to talk about anti aging treatments. So what are the most effective anti aging treatments and what Are the biggest myths surrounding these types of treatments?
15:19
Eva Claiborne
Yes, I can say from my experience retinol and I compare it where I lived in Europe and when I am here in United States. And so we used retinol after acne treatment for scarring here we use it as anti aging product. And retinol is good, especially in California. I would recommend to my clients from October till March, once or twice a week and cover it up with moisturizer. But the summertime, because the sun is so strong here, I would let the skin rest a little bit. But many of my clients who came to me at the first time and their skin is bright red and thinning out. My first question, how long you been using retinol? And they said, oh, been years. And I said, can we have a little rest? And then from October you can go back again.
16:29
Eva Claiborne
And I think that's a little bit. They overusing it.
16:33
Dr. Fan
Yeah, I see that a lot as well. And how do people, you know, sometimes people will get on regimens and they think that hey, it's, you know, one regimen forever, but in reality it doesn't really. That really isn't what's best for our skin, right?
16:49
Eva Claiborne
Yes.
16:49
Dr. Fan
Can you talk, you know, can you talk about that a little bit?
16:51
Eva Claiborne
Yes. I would change the home care regimen seasonally, winter, spring, summer and fall. Because we have different environment, the skin needs different things and we always want to balance the skin. That's why it's healthy, balanced skin.
17:08
Dr. Fan
That's great. And that's really smart advice. And you know, when you look back and think about all of the sort of decades of experience that you have, I'm sure you learned some, you know, some secrets of skin care or secrets of the human body. You know, what do you think is the sort of, you know, the single most interesting or most important thing that you've learned that you know, that you wish you could tell everybody, don't hang.
17:35
Eva Claiborne
Up with the price. I think the price is a marketing. The lower priced product can be just as good than 1500 dollars serum. So I would just really research what the ingredients. I would go more for natural organic product which is made in a laboratory and carefully than a big department store product which is, I think they are way overpriced.
18:12
Dr. Fan
Yeah, yeah. There's no question in the world of skincare there are literally as you mentioned, thousands of products and they come at all different types of price points as well as all different types of sort of, I guess marketing angles. And sometimes you have to separate the marketing from the actual sort of ingredients in the products. Right. And that's one of the, you know, one of the most important reasons, seeing an expert like you or like me, you know, it's important because, you know, it's hard to sort of figure these things out on your own.
18:45
Eva Claiborne
Yes.
18:46
Dr. Fan
And what are some of the most, I guess the newest cutting edge anti aging treatments that you're most excited about?
18:54
Eva Claiborne
I love hydrafacial combination with micro needling and also hydration. Hydration, yeah.
19:03
Dr. Fan
That's great. And is there anything that you know that you're most excited about that you think that you think you'll be able to use coming in the future? Are there any future sort of treatments that you've heard about but maybe aren't popular yet or most people don't know about anything that excites you?
19:21
Eva Claiborne
I would like to. Not yet, but I'm keep searching, going to the conferences and see what's out there and I would love to give it to my client.
19:31
Dr. Fan
Well, that's great. That's great. And I know we've touched upon a lot of different things, but for everyone listening out there and they are asking themselves, well, gosh, there's so many estheticians around. How do I find a good esthetician?
19:50
Eva Claiborne
It's hard. It's hard because education is different here in United States. So when we study in Europe, it's a career, we study for a lifetime. That's what we would like to do here is, I think, too much opportunities for different work. They just want to get through the school, through the licensing. And so that's why a lot of estheticians can survive, because if they don't understand the skin, they don't give a good treatment, then they won't be able to stay in business.
20:30
Dr. Fan
And can I ask you if you had like a really close friend who was across the country in like New York City, for example, and maybe you don't know personally know any estheticians there? What would you tell that friend to look for? You know, what would you tell them to look for? What would you tell them to maybe stay away from, to have a good.
20:49
Eva Claiborne
Background, have a good clean office and using a good product? I think that's very important. And the education, how long they've been in the business. And I think that's very important.
21:07
Dr. Fan
Yeah. I'd like to take a minute now to talk about sort of skincare products. We've talked a little bit about how there are thousands of products available and some of which I know we both think are quite good. Others we think maybe aren't quite so good. And it's really hard for consumers to know to choose. But I understand that you've developed some of your own products and I'd love to know learn a little bit about what you've developed and why you developed them.
21:35
Eva Claiborne
Yes, I developed TiTok naturals and Tito mean in Hungarian secret. So natural secret for healthy, beautiful skin. And it's all natural ingredients. Even the emulgator is an organic version. Some of them is certified organic product. It's created in a dermatology laboratory. And I work closely with the chemist and I have a lot of skin allergies through the years working with different products. But I am a sensitive person. So I have allergy and I cannot work with everything. So I could have my fingers fell up or I can cough if I smell, artificial smell.
22:24
Eva Claiborne
And so I decided I would like to have a product line which is pure, which is help to heal the skin, hydrate and moisturize and working in the plastic surgeon office and see a lot of patients who had laser after laser and just think about the bottom line and the patient skin get more and more sensitive. I have a fantastic line for sensitive rosacea skin, which is a calming line, a calming serum and a calming cream which is fantastic in the doctor's office. It's completely rehabilitated the skin. It's helped the skin because if the skin is calm and hydrated, the laser, it's even better. And before the surgeries like the facelift, a facial neck surgery, if the skin is clean and hydrated, less opportunity for infection. And also it's easier to work with the skin and the patient heal better.
23:39
Dr. Fan
Sure. And so it sounds like, if I'm hearing correctly, that you know, after having, you know, sort of been challenged yourself by having sensitive skin and having allergies, that you wanted to create a product that could, you know, make the skin sort of calmer and more healthy and in a way that is gentle and can be used by people even with sensitive skin.
24:05
Eva Claiborne
Yes.
24:05
Dr. Fan
Am I hearing that correctly?
24:07
Eva Claiborne
Yes. Sensitive and more hydrated skin.
24:10
Dr. Fan
Yeah. Yeah, that's, that's great. And how did you end up, you know, sort of determining, you know, what to put into the, sort of the. Into the products.
24:18
Eva Claiborne
And I've been studying this for. Since I'm over 40 years and created different skincare lines, but because this is the most healing, the last skincare line I created. Yeah, I think this is one of.
24:32
Dr. Fan
My favorite yeah, it sounds wonderful. It sounds like something I personally. Yeah, I'm gonna. After the show, I'm gonna make sure I get my hands on some of it, and I wanna sort of be able to like, use it for myself, but also maybe use it with some patients, because I do see a lot of patients that have, you know, skin that clearly is overstimulated and is full of inflammation and not particularly happy. And, you know, if there's a product that didn't help the skin calm down, it could be very, very helpful.
25:01
Eva Claiborne
Yes, thank you. Thank you very much. I'm happy to share with you.
25:05
Dr. Fan
Great.
25:06
Eva Claiborne
What would you like to see in your. With your patient? What type of skincare would you like to see in your office?
25:14
Dr. Fan
Well, gosh, you know, it's a great question. And I think, you know, I'd really like to see first and foremost, just for every sort of person to just spend a little bit of time taking care of their. Their skin. You know, we are all so busy and we are all overwhelmed, and some of us aren't sure what to do. So it's easy to sort of, you know, neglect the skin. And everyone can do just some very basic things that can set the foundation for health. And, you know, you and I, as beauty professionals, you know these things like the back of our hand. But some things that everyone can do, you know, first thing is just have a good, simple skincare regimen that you do every day.
25:53
Dr. Fan
On top of that, to make sure that you take care of yourself by eating healthy, by avoiding the sun, by hydrating your skin, and those basic things which so many of us, you know, are neglecting, itself creates the foundation for a healthy body and therefore healthy skin. And then on top of that, for, you know, anyone who really wants to age gracefully, as I like to say that I think making sure that you see a professional regularly is important. You know, it's a little bit like taking care of your teeth. You definitely need to be at home and you need to brush your teeth, you need to floss, but at the same time, you need to go see your dentist so that they can sort of do the extra cleaning and reset things to set the foundation.
26:39
Dr. Fan
And then obviously, on top of that, if you're struggling with any specific condition, you know, where there's something else going on top of it, you need to see the expert to be able to get help with that. And so, you know, I don't wish for anything too crazy, but I really just wish everyone would spend a little bit of time taking Care of themselves.
26:56
Eva Claiborne
Yes. Thank you so much.
26:59
Dr. Fan
I'd love to take a minute to talk about the different types of skincare regimens that are possible. Obviously, a lot of people that are taking care of their skin at home, so they're doing what we call a home care regimen. There are certainly lots of people walking into my office or my colleagues or a dermatologist, and they're getting medical sort of skincare regimens. And then there's sort of something that I consider that sits in between home care and medical, and that's something that's like seeing an esthetician. Can you talk a little bit about sort of what it means, you know, what an esthetician's skincare regimen is and how it can combine with either a home care regimen or with a medical care regimen?
27:38
Eva Claiborne
Yes, yes. The home care regimen is not enough to do that. You need a professional treatment. And that's when a client or patient choose either medical, aesthetic or regular estheticians. And I think the combination of the two is very good. I like laser, I like chemical pill. But just the most important thing, the hydration, the rehabilitation of the skin between the two treatments, or between two lasers, between two chemical pills, that's very important.
28:14
Dr. Fan
Yeah, absolutely. I couldn't agree more. That, you know, there's one element of really taking care of the fundamental skin itself, and it doesn't necessarily involve something very strong or aggressive. And yet at the same time, if we're really needing to repair the skin or to deal with a condition that is not responding to something more gentle, that's where the stronger care regimens really come into play.
28:43
Eva Claiborne
Yes.
28:44
Dr. Fan
Well, and I've got maybe just one last question. So you've been in practice for about 45 years. What does the average person need to know about skincare?
28:57
Eva Claiborne
Skincare is very important for every person in our everyday life. And start early enough. Like in Hungary we started for when we turned 14 and go until you can to not only the skin feel good and hydrated and relaxed, but also skincare is not only for the skin. It's also we feel good and we feel good about ourselves. We feel beautiful, and that's also part of our life. To love ourself and feel beautiful.
29:39
Dr. Fan
Yeah, absolutely. You know, I have this expression just, you know, when we look good, we feel good, and when we feel good, you know, we radiate. And it really does mean it come from the inside and it shows outside. Yes, great. Well, thank you so much, Eva, for coming in. It's been sort of a wonderful episode for me. It's been a fascinating discussion.
30:00
Eva Claiborne
Thank you so much for having me.
30:02
Dr. Fan
Oh, you're very welcome.
30:03
Eva Claiborne
It's my pleasure to be here.
30:05
Dr. Fan
You're very welcome. Well, that's a wrap, everyone. So, you know, thanks, everybody, for listening, and we'll see you at the next episode of the Fan Method. In the meantime, stay well and stay fantastic.